images and words ~ statues

joining the group at muzenews

okay, giving this group a try!

a few here might recognize the statue,

and the words come from a song

most memorable as performed by the Mamas and the Papas

Make your Own Kind of Music

lyrics come from a  'pop' song

written by Barry Mann and Cynthia Weil

roller coasters....

People change their minds all the time....  they make one decision and then another... it's is most profoundly true in marriages that are destined 'not' to make it... just how many times will the couple reconcile or when will they put to end to it all?

  

I know that I put my mother through hell back in the 70's...  I married someone she just didn't like, and quite honestly 'he' didn't put much effort in making any ties with her at all.  Most of the time he was 'himself' 'like it or leave it'~ which was rude and occasionally explosive. 

In my juvenile attempts to portray a 'happy home' I conveyed the message to her that I needed her support, and bless her, she tried.  LOL, sometimes through gritted teeth, but she tried.  Maybe until the first time he hit me... and maybe even after that... sigh....  when I think of what I put my mother through for those 8 years...  there were times that I didn't call her as often as I should have... those were the worst times.  Because I wanted to call, but it would only be bad news about the relationship, I know [now] how I stressed her out.

I gave her a grandchild during those years ~ turns out the only one she ever got ~ and it became her mission to put up with the 'father' to have access to her grandson, and she did. Mom was a trooper and a strong one at that.....    And she was a life saver for me, for during the darkest hours she kept the boy with her, so I could battle the demon himself.

I know now what she went through, the agony of feeling like she 'lost' her daughter... the uncertainty of every encounter as a family, the misery she mush have felt and the tears she probably spent.   I'm guessing that Karma came back to kick me in the butt for what I did to my mom.... and I've told Karma that I know what I did and I hope that all the good years afterwards, and there were so many, made up for it, I do know I tried.....

...because now... my son and his wife have split up.  A short marriage, spent mostly on egg-shells for my son, is over.  Am I tempting fate by writing this ~ while things are still unofficial? I hope not!  I've cried tears over the feeling that I had 'lost' my son, imagining [while then unconfirmed] when his too long silences gave me the sense that things were not right, not happy, not good....  and I was my mother.... all over again....

When I offered love and respect and family and friendship to my new DIL and no bond was required from her, rebuffed... I was my mother....

When I thought, I have to stay silent, and enjoy what little parts of them or him,  I may get.... I was my mother....  and I cried....

'She' moved out of their apartment during the Christmas break while he was visiting with us, it affected him with a profound emotional and physical reaction, even though it had been decided before he came to visit.  I think that my son [like me] always felt that things would get better.  I applaud her for being enough of how ever you would want to describe it, to make the decisions that have followed.  I think my son would have given it another try....  but NOW he is good with it, her moving out, getting legalities under way, reclaiming his space and his life, building his future.... I am so happy they are not going to ride the 'change my mind' carousel, which is always a poor choice....

And am I tempting fate? No, I don't think so....  the other day, soon to be ex DIL put me on her 'restricted' list on f/b, not quite gutsy enough to delete me! lol....  I am waiting for that....  so I equally 'restricted' her [so she has no access to my photos] and I restricted her mother too....   and you know what? after the visit that was so awful in May, the visit that left me crying for months,  I feel such a sense of relief, I know my mom is smiling down for me.... 

Thankful Perspective...

I've been thinking about it all month, as I've watched people list the things they are thankful for.  Somewhere in my mind, I started a list of practical 'things' [seat belts and airbags for starters] and non practical thoughts about what I may be thankful for....  but it all seemed to come into perspective this weekend, when on Thanksgiving Day, which was my 58th birthday, I placed a call to Florida, to my ex inlaws to wish them a Happy Thanksgiving and to check on them.  'Dad' will be 90 next year and mom to be 89.  After nearly 68 years of marriage, they live unassisted and manage ~ despite immense medical issues.  I was greeted by my ex BIL, and the news that 'mom' had passed the night before.  

The magnitude of shock that exploded in my heart is still raw for me, the tears unpredictable, and ache of love for my 'other' mother of 39 years just hangs heavy.  It can't have been ten days since we last spoke, and as always, I told her I loved her.  And I did.... The end went fast for her, for that I am thankful, there were enough conditions to weigh her down.   I was only married to her son for 8 pretty bad years, but she is my son's grandmother, she was always my friend and I have never stopped loving or respecting her....

After Bernie and my mother died [within 22 days of each other] I flew to be with them, [their son/my ex had died a few years before]. Just being with them brought me some comfort, I was at home there.  And I've been there quite a few times since, even bringing David to meet them.  The funeral is on Tuesday and I can not go.  I have travel restrictions from the accident and am devastated not to be there.  But I know from all that has happened to me in the past few years, that it will be more important to have time for 'dad' hopefully after my travel restrictions have passed.   

I had to break the news to Clint when he called to wish me a Happy Birthday.  It had been a festive day in their apartment in Istanbul.  They celebrated Thanksgiving with about 40 people. I'm glad his day was nearly over when I had to tell him his nanna had passed.  I know there is some regret for not getting there this past summer so that nanna could meet his new wife...  but in general his regrets are also few.

It's the memories that sustain me, the precious threads of thoughts that bring the past into the present and let me be touched again and again with what really matters from life.  The memories I make now and the memories of all that has passed, I pray never to lose them.  Memories and time well spent, for that I will always be thankful.....

the forces of motions and kindness....

Riding a motor scooter along a tropical Caribbean coastline has been one of those few things that David has on his very small 'bucket list'.  Somehow it always seems 'so romantic' in the movies... That bucket list also included maybe riding a motorcycle, CanAm or trike.... that is, however, his bucket list, I find that our weekends spent on our seadoos is personally 'enough' for me.... lol.... 

 [our his and hers scooter rental]

Our upcoming cruise to the Caribbean would certainly be the 'the time' to fulfill his fantasy. Now, neither one of us have ever driven a motor scooter, and don't forget I have some wicked vertigo, but I was once a passenger on a scooter back in the early eighty's when Bernie and I were in Cancun.  I've been doing the research to see which of our 5 stop islands would be the optimum experience and the more I read the more 'alarmed' I was becoming. 

It's nothing like the movies!  We are still cruise 'new-bees', only having 'one' under the belt, and the facts would really be that we arrive into the port/harbor part of town on our cruise ship...  we would have to get our selves to a rental office, then navigate the streets of a city [even if small] amidst their morning rush hours of traffic, sometimes on the left side of the road, on smaller streets, with chaos ruling the road.  All to get ourselves out to some country roads [if we survived]  to find ourselves on winding  roads, and in a little more danger than I was looking for.   All of this however, was not a deterrent to David, he still felt it was 'something' he had to do....sigh....

[my first lesson]

So, Last Week, which seems so very long ago, we were on one of the Outer Banks coastal islands. David had classes for three days, and I got to roam around with my camera.  On Friday, I picked him up after class and said I have a surprise for you!  I was really excited!  David is always going out of his way to create romantic gestures for me, the list is long.  And while I try to do the same, finding a way to really surprise him thrills me!

We arrived at Beachside Bikes and I get to tell him, we are going to learn how to ride scooters!  The owner of the small shop took his time with each of us, using his 'proven method'... I was scared silly and vertigo in full swing.... but with patience, I learned, David snapping pictures of me the whole time.... then it was David's turn to learn and he took right to it.  Our teacher took us on a practice run, and then finally guided us through the very quiet streets of Atlantic Beach to bypass the 'big' intersection I was terrified of, and he let us loose!

We had an hour on our scooters, taking the road out to the east end of the Island and arriving at Fort Macon. We rode around the lots and got back on the open road heading back into town, even navigating the 'big intersection', arriving back at Beachside Bikes....  we had a great hour. It was the optimum experience of have a great instructor and very low traffic.  Lol, afterwards we went out to play miniature golf and have a fun dinner.

[my eggplant stuffed with seafood]

David's surf & turf

We got back to our routine that next Monday morning, I was driving in with David for the week, as the Nurse/Medical asst. was on vacation and I was filling in for her.  Often those first few days we talked about the 'scooter experience' and David seemed even more pumped about trying out a motorcycle or getting a CanAm for retirement.  Luckily though, the idea of motor scootering through the islands was satisfied as I breathed a sigh of relief.  I could get back to planning our excursions.  

On Wed. evening as we were driving home, I was mentally planning the evening of expecting to hostess the new book club I am in.  I had snacks prepared, wine chilling, and we needed to pick up only one more thing.  I asked David what movie was on the schedule for the weekend, and what else he would like to do, while I mentioned I would like to go see my chiropractor....  David was AGAIN talking about finding some place to take motorcycle riding lessons....

and then in the blink of a moment, in what now repeats itself in slow motion, we were in a wreck....  the slow motion of the crash and sounds and everything that followed seems to be stuck on rewind....  the things I said, like where is the air bag? the moment before it burst open before me, and the words call 911 in between are you okay?  ... the faces of strangers : "I'm  a nurse" , a man who understood my gestures and opened my door [refusing to let me get out] but rummaging around my feet to find my glasses and my cell...  the peace officer who assisted David to get out of the car and had the EMS there, in what seemed only minutes....  the neck immobilizer and back board of misery, the IV of morphine, the kindness of everyone....  

the night never seemed to end and this had all started about 4:45pm...  we were sent to Wake Med North, a huge triage center... they were already dealing with half of a two school bus crash involving 30 students [thankfully all minor injuries] ... they were busy.  David was in his room, I was in mine, and Michelle got there quickly, she was our liaison..... after my full body CT scan and additional knee X-rays, it was determined I needed to be transported to big Wake, for more extensive neck x-rays and to be admitted, and David was being released with three broken bones in his right foot, and chest contusions,  and all the miseries associated with slamming into an airbag, etc.   He and Michelle settled into my room until my transport arrived.  I could not move my head to see, but within moments, Michelle was in the hall yelling for a nurse.  They came back in and David was 'crashing' in his wheelchair, they quickly got him on a gurney [readmitted] with an open IV, his pressure 80/40 and falling, quickly into a CT machine, thinking the aorta had been damaged.  His pressure came back up, aorta intact and he recovered.  

By now I had been transported, clutching my cellphone waiting on news from Michelle about David.  She eventually drove him home, and somewhere around 1:30am he called and was settling into the recliner.  Shortly after that Clint called me, having hunted me down after getting emails from Shaun, to which Clint woke at the other side of the world...   somewhere around 3 am I was admitted into a room, the neck brace finally removed and somewhere around 6am I managed to fall asleep for the first time in about 24 hours....   it wasn't a long sleep...  hospital routines have to happen....  I was hungry enough to eat my jello and chicken broth breakfast, but was ready to say no to the next morphine shot... they offered a pain pump, my sternum was fractured,a hematoma behind it,  my rib cartilage cracked or broken, and I had not yet moved into a sitting position since I was removed from the car...  I refused the pain pump too...  took a double dose of pain pills and began my determined return.   Somewhere in the morning the aide came and kindly gave me a sponge bath.  That first hot cloth I could wipe across my face was bliss, she made me feel clean. She also order some real food for me, another kindness.  The general surgeon came and went... the list of what was wrong was long, but in my mind, all things that will heal, life will go on.  The list of restrictions is long too... sigh...

My goals of the morning included my first pee without the foley, and sitting...  check...  then determined as I am, I walked the halls, and even more determined, I was ready to leave although they suggested a second night due to high level of pain meds, and the fractures.... I walked more hall some more and I went home.

Michelle brought me home around 5 pm...  there has not been a single move that does not come with the sound of pain from either of us.  Over the last two days David is healing faster than I am.  He is able to move around a little better but with that comes tremendous fatigue.  Any time spent on his foot is painful.  Enterprise has delivered the rental car.  On Friday morning, I discovered email that a 'Meal Train' had been placed in effect for us from my bookclub ladies....  these women barely know me.....  they have signed up to bring us meals over the next few days. And they have delivered!  What an amazing kindness!  When I read that ~ I was overcome to tears, and crying hurts far worse than laughing.    We took our first showers yesterday morning, David offering to step in there and wash my hair, since I can not raise my arms up... and last night when I so desperately wanted to sleep in the bed instead of my recliner, he thought up the answers to making that work too..... 

I am sitting here writing this morning, with a ice pack on my knee, one on my ribs, one across my chest, one on an elbow and one at the nape of my neck... we are going to rest today, David's kids have all been finding a niche of how they can help, my neighbors and new friends have all rallied and I know we have been in the prayers of those who are not here....  for all that ~ I am very thankful ....  every kindness is appreciated....

PS...  David has crossed all non-automotive travel off of his bucket list....  I  am thankful for that too, [winks] ~  and this week I will have to cancel the cruise and airline tickets,  I bought trip insurance in the event of anything happening to his mom, but my restrictions are too limiting to enjoy the time....  can you imagine me not being able to lift my camera!!??

goldilocks and the three beds....

somewhere.....

we were just somewhere awful... the walls were like dark smooty rough concrete, and the ground was sharp and jagged cobblestone... we were packed into this holding area or cell, 

dirty, 

smelly and starved for sunshine, food, and rest....  my body was racked with pain, I could feel the uneven cutting and bruising of the cold stone underneath every bit of bone and flesh as I tried to sleep....  the pain was real.....   I ached and cried over the memory of my wonderful bed....  I screamed....

and just as I cried aloud...

truly cried out loud.... 

somehow ~ I was transported to my own plush mattress, snuggled warm and cradled in pleasure.... or that was at least where I dreamed myself to be...

that was the dream that woke me this morning on one of the worst mattresses I have ever slept on....    here it is over twelve hours later and my neck and low back and hip feel permanently damaged.... [yes, she does whines....] 

I thought that H***ton Inns & Suites were uniform....  I get points for staying here!  I love the fresh cookies that pop out of their ovens for a few hours every single evening.

 I always come back.....   sigh....   something went wrong for sure....

David had a bad night sleep too, although he seemed less affected ~ it was still noticeable... we are on the Outbanks.  He's got a conference and I get 2.5 days to sit by the sea and drink in the October sky and the gentle waves and go out to eat seafood dinners....  this I don't complain about....

I dropped him off just moments after the sunrise, so by the time I drove to the beach where I could walk and take pictures.... I got the golden glow of morning...

Returning to the hotel to ready for the day, I stopped by the desk to make chit chat about the mattress and they offered to change the room....  but I would have to come back around noon and test the few rooms that would be available.... 

yes, I did.... 

One was only moderately better, 

the other was the same, 

and then they gave me a key to a room that was still occupied....  

oops....

finally a better mattress....  one that [I hope] will be "just right" for tonight's sleep....

[pics can be enlarges by clicking on them]

October, I am.....

October has arrived.... 

for most of us [non tropic dwellers] in the northern hemisphere

October brings cooler days and longer nights,

it is confirmation of a new season, 

and a reminder of the circle of life....  

while I really don't have a favorite, 

I can find something to love about every season... 

calling to mind that the older I get,

 the more my senses long to linger on appreciating the changes.

October seems to heighten 

the sense of smell for me.... 

something about the freshness in the outside air 

can make me feel more alive....

for some reason sitting in the early low sun and cool morning breeze

sipping hot coffee to read the Sunday paper feels great...

I am looking forward to the change in colors soon too,

 they don't have to be vivid, the subtle hues will do... 

it's not lost on me, the daily progression, I savor it.

...and before I know it, the skies of November will captivate me.... 

every one a new play on pinks and blues,

by December it will get dark too early, 

my hibernation mode will kick in....

the fireplace will get lit, 

and eventually the twinkle of lights on a tree will lull me ....

another year, counting my blessings

to laugh, live and love.... on the horizon.

October brings my new wedding anniversary,

can you imagine? 

Somehow I was blessed a second time in this life

to share the laughter and tears,

 the promise of growing old together

with a loving and romantic husband

two souls to love and cherish each other.... 

Something not to be dismissed lightly.

[low light of Oct. afternoon]

this October also allows me new moments to reflect

I realize that sometimes I have no tears, I worry

am I feeling less? have I suppressed myself? assured

 [by hubby] that this is the pendulum of extremes...

 to long at having worked my emotions from highs

 to lows, and eventually maybe back again....

I am changed yet again, a new season, a new me...

I never imagined what changes could evolve in me

all the things that make me what I am.....

disclaimer:  lol.....  this is a repost from Oct. 2011....   

would you want to know?

...this is a serious question for me, and David and I differ completely on our answers.... would YOU want to know when you are going to die?? I don't mean to be gruesome in any way.... but my answer is yes,and 'I' would like to know, even if it was going to be today.... I don't have all the reasons formulated in my head about the whys, it is more likely an emotional issue for me....[like: seriously, I didn't want to wake up some morning and discover xply was gone without warning! ~ they gave us a date....see what I mean?] granted, some of people's standard answers are about : why would it matter? if you love your life, and live for today, and get past all the 'big regrets', you need to just accept you won't know... and I do accept it, even if I don't agree with it.... sigh....

In the 'olden' days when someone was terminally ill, the doctor told the patient's family and they decided if the patient should know!!! hello??.... patients started saying it was their right to know, to tie up loose ends, etc.... and then the tides turned and it did become the patient's right! ... a much more personal issue than you think....

Why this is on my mind this morning, is my book club meeting from last night.... the book we reviewed was 'Still Alice', a most amazing book told from the prospective of a young 49 year old woman who was diagnosed with Early Onset Alzheimer's Disease. This book has greatly affected me, and I've been talking about it with people for weeks now, I even bought an extra copy to give to someone who's husband has been diagnosed. [I can loan it out of my kindle if you have an account]

During our discussion, and maybe past it, most of us agreed we would rather have any other illness than that one, even if it meant we passed away younger. It's a personal choice. And while we discussed personal choices, I made the statement that I am one of those people who want to KNOW... when my time will be up.... I was pretty adamant, while most of the ladies, who like David, said they don't want to know.... which is amazing to me....

So during this lively discussion, one of our member told us that her husband was terminal, he is 48 and when his colon cancer [stage 4] was found it was already spread to his liver, and they were told, all we can do is prolong his life with treatments, he has about a year. Well the year is past and Duke Medical Center Oncology Center is keeping him going, but he knows, soon it will be over. They have three children, 18, 10 and 6.... they are living life to the fullest, like she said, this time now is their retirement, and they are trying to live it up.... and she says she doesn't want to know what day he will pass or when her time will come, she just has to do the best she can do. And she softly said that maybe in the face of loss that 'I' would feel different.

Quietly I said that I have been there too, with a terminal husband and mother at the very same time and that made me feel even stronger about wanting the knowledge. I don't have any big regrets behind me... and do I wish for things I [we] didn't do ?? ~ well sometimes, but would they have done anyway? who knows.... so I leave with that pondering question if you would really want to know?



cut and paste from xply comments:

edit delete reply msowens1 wrote on Sep 27 I am out of here today peeps.... gotta deal with MIL's paperwork in person, and have to take my 'baby' [my IMac] into the Apple store.... am hearing a funny noise on the big machine.... be home this evening....

delete reply thegreatoz wrote on Sep 27 Yes, I would want to know.

delete reply klintm wrote on Sep 27 aaaaaaaawww honey, I understand you wanting to know................hugs you tight. The truth is no one knows but our maker, right?? And if we knew, we had exactly 6 months, 1 week, 2 days, 12 hours, would that not make us totally frantic, busy, stressed, trying to finish things that might not matter anyway??? I gave my heart to Our Lord long ago, with that my Life to do with what he wants and in HIs Time. I understand though the need one might have to know exactly especially in a illness that is terminal, but the doctors don't know for sure, it is all guess work and often proven wrong anyway Agree with you 100 % on Alzheimers, anything but that one !!! How do you feel about the right to terminate your own life by the way?????????? Anyone out there ????? That is something I am pretty passionate about, I would like to have the right to say " fine, now I am finished with it" and I am well aware that is against anything the Bible ever taught me and that in the eyes of Christianity it would be considered a crime. If ever I was diagnosed with something pretty horrible terminal, painful , degrading for me and a burden on my relatives, I would like to be able to say " pull the plug" Your views?????????

delete reply thegreatoz wrote on Sep 27 klintm said I would like to have the right to say " fine, now I am finished with it"  I think that I already do have that right . . . unfortunately, the law disagrees with me. ;-)

delete reply klintm wrote on Sep 27 thegreatoz said I think that I already do have that right . . . unfortunately, the law disagrees with me. ;-)  yes that is the problem is it not and whoever helps you , could be prosecuted ???

delete reply trixyschaos wrote on Sep 27, edited on Sep 27 klintm said How do you feel about the right to terminate your own life by the way?????????? Anyone out there ????? That is something I am pretty passionate about, I would like to have the right to say " fine, now I am finished with it" and I am well aware that is against anything the Bible ever taught me and that in the eyes of Christianity it would be considered a crime. If ever I was diagnosed with something pretty horrible terminal, painful , degrading for me and a burden on my relatives, I would like to be able to say " pull the plug" Your views?????????  This is exactly what i was going to bring up with my answer to the question..... No ...I don't want to know the day or the time or the hour, BUT if it would make my passing easier for those who love me.....then yes I would want -them- to know.....I either want it quick--or I want it as pain free as possible. Now....here's my thoughts ....I believe in the right for any person of sound mind and body, to be able to choose whether or not they live....if a person chooses to not suffer and wants to end their life or to have their life ended, IF they face an incurable disease or are suffering....or have before hand had their wishes written out.... then they or I should have that right. I'm going to be blunt honest....Losing my mind while I pee and poop all over myself, getting to the point that I can't feed myself, or don't remember my family.....dying slowly from cancer to the point that I'm struggling .....that's not my idea of an "easy way to go"--and if I want to choose to end my life, so that I dont suffer and my family doesnt suffer while watching me deteriorate in front of them than that should be -my- right.

delete reply goofygreeneyes wrote on Sep 27 i dont know....i need to think more...

delete reply mrsrh wrote on Sep 27 Really not sure how to answer.

delete reply crazykk wrote on Sep 27 I have no idea how to answer this.

delete reply serendipitydreams wrote on Sep 27 Your brain is fascinating

delete reply magickat wrote on Sep 27 Yes, I'd want to know. That way I could plan, and do things I would have put off "till later"...I would like to know.

delete reply lacidanielle wrote on Sep 27 I was first going to say no but I changed my mind. I would want to know so I could go back home where I'd like my ashes to be buried. I'd like to see my family overseas one last time and die where I was born ...in their midst. As far as the right to die....well, we don't let our pets suffer a painful, wretched death, so why should we? I think when we've had enough of this world, we should have the legal right to say, I'd like to leave next week or next month ...or today. It would be nice to have loved ones around me sharing my last day with love and laughter, music, great food, wine and chocolate...chocolate and lots of it. That would be preferable to being in agony and not even guaranteed that someone will hold my hand when it's my time to cross over.

delete reply auntbee46 wrote on Sep 27, edited on Sep 27 I absolutely do NOT want to know when I'm going to die!! I think it would just depress the hell out of me. -And watching that clock tick, tick, tick away - knowing I have 10, 9, 8, 7.....minutes to live? No thanks!!! As for the right to end your own life, I guess I think it should be an option, but with the stipulation that you must sign a legal paper when you are in your right mind as to what constitutes enough for you, who is authorized to help you when the time comes if you are not able to carry it out yourself, and that a doctor must sign off that he agrees when the time comes that those stipulations have been met. I would hate to see someone "put down" just because someone was tired of taking care of grandma, or had held a grudge against his mother his entire life.

delete reply secclux wrote on Sep 27 Yeah..I would like an idea. Of course, I am the one that watches the shots I get too. Seems to make it better for me!

delete reply semisweetsioux wrote on Sep 27, edited on Sep 27 I would say emphatically YES . . . yes, I DO want to know, not so I could sit there watching the clock tick tick tick (as bee so eloquently put it) but so that I would for sure have a chance to say good bye . . . tie up any loose ends that needed tying . . . tell my children and grandchildren one last time that I loved them . . . and not to be sad, because I wasn't afraid to die . . . But yeah . . . I would definitely like to have advance notice . . . That was actually one of the things that totally freaked me out a year ago when I almost died of spinal meningitis . . . My last conscious thought was of walking upstairs to go lay down because my head hurt SO badly . . . and I woke up 36 hours later in the ICU . . . It shook me to my core that I HADN'T had any sense of finality or even a brief 'ok . . . this is it' . . . I really, really want that . . . My belief system says to leave the 'when' in God's hands and trust that there is purpose -- significant purpose -- even in prolonged deaths . . . I do believe that . . . and I have seen that in the lives of people I have known and loved . . . but I wouldn't judge people who decide that there is no reason not to end things in a more timely manner when the end is inevitable and there is no quality of life . . . I understand the feelings behind that kind of decision totally . . . I do not think I would ever choose it, but I understand why people do . . . And I have that book, too, but since we are in the midst of dealing with my mother-in-law's slow descent into severe Alzheimers, I just have not been able to bring myself to read it . . . I am afraid that it will be too much to be LIVING it, as well as READING it . . . I intend to read it someday . . . and who knows, maybe I will suddenly get the urge to read it now . . .

edit delete reply msowens1 wrote on Sep 27, edited on Sep 27 thegreatoz said I think that I already do have that right . . . unfortunately, the law disagrees with me. ;-)  what a sorry commentary on our humanity.... the part where you have a right you can not exercise.....

edit delete reply msowens1 wrote on Sep 27 klintm said aaaaaaaawww honey, I understand you wanting to know................hugs you tight.  I hope I am not sending the wrong message about wanting to know.... it's really the purist in me, or the practical, or the sentimental.... it's for the order of life and things left for others....

delete reply hotstone2go wrote on Sep 27 Yes, if it was possible, I think I might like to know...that would hopefully give me time to cram in all the stuff I planned to do before I go. But, on the other hand, I do most of that anyway, I'm right with my maker, so if he wants me today, here I am. If not, well, guess I'll hang around until they turn the lights out, or they toss my ashes to the four winds.

edit delete reply msowens1 wrote on Sep 27 klintm said How do you feel about the right to terminate your own life by the way??????????  I agree with a lot of statements here, that the dignity of 'being terminal' should be allowed, and yes, for myself.... if the circumstances were such, I would want to exercise the 'right'....

delete reply auntbee46 wrote on Sep 27 I should clarify that I personally can't ever see me exercising that right, as God said Thou shalt not kill - and that includes yourself - but I am not everyone, and I think folks should be able to make that decision for themselves if that's what they want. Maybe they don't believe in my God, or in any God, or still want that right even if they do believe in God - I think it should be their own decision based on their own beliefs.

delete reply auntbee46 wrote on Sep 27 secclux said I am the one that watches the shots I get too  Now *that* doesn't bother me!

edit delete reply msowens1 wrote on Sep 27 I wanted to start replying to each of these comments, and I have ten interruptions going on at once... geez...... I will be back shortly....

delete reply hotstone2go wrote on Sep 27 msowens1 said I wanted to start replying to each of these comments, and I have ten interruptions going on at once... geez...... I will be back shortly....  okey dokey! LOL

delete reply sweetpotatoqueen wrote on Sep 27 Nope..have no interest in worrying about death while living. If I had a terminal disease I would appreciate a proposed length of life to say my final goodbyes,otherwise if I could know the way and the when of the date of my death I would refuse. We all are going die...enjoy the ride,carpe diem etc.

delete reply poetessgarden wrote on Sep 27 trixyschaos said that should be -my- right.  Amen...

edit delete reply msowens1 wrote on Sep 27 sweetpotatoqueen said Nope..have no interest in worrying about death while living. If I had a terminal disease I would appreciate a proposed length of life to say my final goodbyes,otherwise if I could know the way and the when of the date of my death I would refuse. We all are going die...enjoy the ride,carpe diem etc.  I do enjoy the ride immensely..... I can not help the nature of myself, which would be that I would prefer to know..... and not for any other 'reason' than I want.... the why's have no basis in logic, just emotion....

edit delete reply msowens1 wrote on Sep 27 hotstone2go said Yes, if it was possible, I think I might like to know...that would hopefully give me time to cram in all the stuff I planned to do before I go. But, on the other hand, I do most of that anyway, I'm right with my maker, so if he wants me today, here I am. If not, well, guess I'll hang around until they turn the lights out, or they toss my ashes to the four winds.  I like the way you think.....

edit delete reply msowens1 wrote on Sep 27 semisweetsioux said so that I would for sure have a chance to say good bye . . . tie up any loose ends that needed tying . . . tell my children and grandchildren one last time that I loved them . . . and not to be sad, because I wasn't afraid to die . . . But yeah . . . I would definitely like to have advance notice . . .  a lot of people say, if you live with 'no' regrets it doesn't matter if you don't have the chance to do the things you are saying, but the truth is that everytime we hug a loved one goodbye we don't make it a last time.... and I wouldn't want to....

edit delete reply msowens1 wrote on Sep 27 semisweetsioux said And I have that book, too, but since we are in the midst of dealing with my mother-in-law's slow descent into severe Alzheimers, I just have not been able to bring myself to read it . . . I am afraid that it will be too much to be LIVING it, as well as READING it . . . I intend to read it someday . . . and who knows, maybe I will suddenly get the urge to read it now  you will be surprised that the book is not predictable.... and it is about Early Onset ~ not when it happens to the 50% of us as we age.... it's being inside Alice's head and seeing things just from her perspective.... which may not always be accurate [her portrayal of her family].... @ my book club it was interesting to see how we differed in interpreting the title itself.... my MIL is severely affected [@90].... when she offers her breast to a stranger, or [before her broken hip] put on 7 pairs of depends, one on top of each other, and one on each breast, and walked out into the hall and LR of her residence.... she would have been mortified in her right mind.....

edit delete reply msowens1 wrote on Sep 27 msowens1 said . she would have been mortified in her right mind.....  and BEE please don't think I mean she should be 'put down'.... but if she had the chance to see what would become of her, she would not want to be there!

edit delete reply msowens1 wrote on Sep 27 semisweetsioux said My belief system says to leave the 'when' in God's hands and trust that there is purpose -- significant purpose -- even in prolonged deaths . . . I do believe that . . . and I have seen that in the lives of people I have known and loved . . . but I wouldn't judge people who decide that there is no reason not to end things in a more timely manner when the end is inevitable and there is no quality of life . . . I understand the feelings behind that kind of decision totally . . . I do not think I would ever choose it, but I understand why people do . . .  well said... the choice should be individual.... but this post was not about this... lol....

edit delete reply msowens1 wrote on Sep 27 secclux said Yeah..I would like an idea. Of course, I am the one that watches the shots I get too. Seems to make it better for me!  maybe it's a monica thing?

edit delete reply msowens1 wrote on Sep 27 auntbee46 said I absolutely do NOT want to know when I'm going to die!! I think it would just depress the hell out of me. -And watching that clock tick, tick, tick away - knowing I have 10, 9, 8, 7.....minutes to live?  because I would want to know, like I want to know the day that xply is going to die, I want to prepare, I am not afraid of what is to come, and I don't question it.... and while I am prepared... I want more...

edit delete reply msowens1 wrote on Sep 27 lacidanielle said I was first going to say no but I changed my mind. I would want to know so I could go back home where I'd like my ashes to be buried. I'd like to see my family overseas one last time and die where I was born ...in their midst.  since you won't get to 'know'.... then people will tell you to go visit again, don't put it off... and make your final wishes known!

edit delete reply msowens1 wrote on Sep 27 lacidanielle said As far as the right to die....well, we don't let our pets suffer a painful, wretched death, so why should we? I think when we've had enough of this world, we should have the legal right to say, I'd like to leave next week or next month ...or today. It would be nice to have loved ones around me sharing my last day with love and laughter, music, great food, wine and chocolate...chocolate and lots of it. That would be preferable to being in agony and not even guaranteed that someone will hold my hand when it's my time to cross over.  how very very true!!!

delete reply oneluckybean wrote on Sep 27, edited on Sep 27 Nope I have no need to know. I live every single day I am allowed..with as few regrets as possible, because we all have a few.. There is a legal way to acknowledge your wishes with your Advanced Directives which everyone should have. I would never put my children..my mom my sister..through that choice of actually ending my life, and then living with that knowledge....but they would and could keep me comfortable and not do anything heroic to prolong my life if the prognosis were terminal.

delete reply oneluckybean wrote on Sep 27 My son died very suddenly..and his death changes nothing for me about the knowing, I would have hated to have days and weeks of pre-mourning knowing the 8th of January would be his last...we have wonderfully happy memories of those last few days and weeks with him..no tears... My friends son did at the same time of a long painful bout with lymphoma, and they knew and hoped and accepted, and were angry and in denial..all long before the actual day of his death..I feel their path was sooo much harder! But some of us dont get a choice..we dont get to know...

delete reply semisweetsioux wrote on Sep 27 Mo, I just wanted to say that this is a really fascinating blog thread . . . Very interesting to read everybody's input and comments . . . Lots of thought-provoking ideas being shared . . .

edit delete reply msowens1 wrote on Sep 27 it is a subject we all have an opinion on.... and I can see the arguments for both sides.... they are ALL valid

delete reply auntbee46 wrote on Sep 27 msowens1 said and BEE please don't think I mean she should be 'put down'.... but if she had the chance to see what would become of her, she would not want to be there!  Oh, Sweetie!!! No, no, no, no, no!!! That thought NEVER crossed my mind - I just brought that up because there are people in this world who would, but I never thought that you were one of them!!

delete reply auntbee46 wrote on Sep 27, edited on Sep 27 msowens1 said because I would want to know, like I want to know the day that xply is going to die, I want to prepare, I am not afraid of what is to come, and I don't question it.... and while I am prepared... I want more...  I don't want to prepare. I don't want to say Good Bye. I hate Good Bye!! Not the see you later type, but the heart crushing "I'll never see you again" Good Bye. I can't stand it. Maybe I'm just a coward, or selfish, but I hate knowing I'll never see someone again, and knowing the date that would mark the beginning of all the days I'd never see everyone again, would be crushing to me. I tell my loved ones how I feel about them all the time, and I am good with knowing that I've already let them know how I feel about them.

delete reply semisweetsioux wrote on Sep 27 msowens1 said it is a subject we all have an opinion on.... and I can see the arguments for both sides.... they are ALL valid  That is what I meant . . . It is a civil, even cordial DISCUSSION . . . nobody mocking any one else's opinion or take on the subject or ranting and raving about differences of opinion . . . I am seriously impressed with your friends!

delete reply auntbee46 wrote on Sep 27 oneluckybean said My son died very suddenly..and his death changes nothing for me about the knowing, I would have hated to have days and weeks of pre-mourning knowing the 8th of January would be his last...we have wonderfully happy memories of those last few days and weeks with him..no tears... My friends son did at the same time of a long painful bout with lymphoma, and they knew and hoped and accepted, and were angry and in denial..all long before the actual day of his death..I feel their path was sooo much harder! But some of us dont get a choice..we dont get to know...  It would rip my heart out no less if I had known in advance that my nephew would take his own life at age 17.

delete reply auntbee46 wrote on Sep 27 semisweetsioux said . It is a civil, even cordial DISCUSSION . . . nobody mocking any one else's opinion or take on the subject or ranting and raving about differences of opinion . . . I agree!!! Pretty awesome!! :)

edit delete reply msowens1 wrote on Sep 27 auntbee46 said It would rip my heart out no less if I had known in advance that my nephew would take his own life at age 17.  You are totally right Bee!!! as well as for Heather..... or anyone's heart ripping losses... my own included..... I guess the knowledge would belong to each person, know about yourself and not anyone else, unless they want to share it....

edit delete reply msowens1 wrote on Sep 27 semisweetsioux said I am seriously impressed with your friends! I love every one of them.....

delete reply hotstone2go wrote on Sep 27 msowens1 said I like the way you think.....  Thank you. And quite frankly, I can see the validity in everyone's opinion here for their various reasons. Our individuality is what makes us all unique, but what draws us to each other as friends. I have to say though that my dad pretty much taught me at an early age to live my life like every day was my last. He always said that you never know how long you have, he died at 58 of a massive heart attack.

delete reply hotstone2go wrote on Sep 27 msowens1 said I love every one of them.....  And we love you too dear Mo!

delete reply auntbee46 wrote on Sep 27 Yeppers!!! We sure do!!! ♥

delete reply trixyschaos wrote on Sep 27 I have to agree with what Heather typed down there when she spoke of a sudden death versus a death that "we knew it was going to happen" is in play.... I've seen both, have felt both versions of this death personally and as well have witnessed it with my patients. From a nurses stand point, neither one, whether knowing or unexpected is easy on family members. In fact I have a hard time saying which is harder on a family--the unexpected or the waiting for it to happen. From the stand point of having experienced each, I suppose in many ways when we were expecting my grandfather to die, when we knew it was coming, while it hurts and it's still a process we went through with grieving.....it was almost a peaceful place because we knew he was no longer suffering. With my sister in law who died suddenly of a pulmonary embolism there is always the shock, the instantaneous grief that overtakes you, and I truly believe that the shock of it all made it so much worse for all of us. My grandmother died suddenly....unexpectedly, and even though it has now been several years ago, I am still going through stages of grief with her loss.

edit delete reply msowens1 wrote on Sep 27 trixyschaos said I have to agree with what Heather typed down there when she spoke of a sudden death versus a death that "we knew it was going to happen" is in play.... I've seen both, have felt both versions of this death personally and as well have witnessed it with my patients. From a nurses stand point, neither one, whether knowing or unexpected is easy on family members. In fact I have a hard time saying which is harder on a family--the unexpected or the waiting for it to happen. From the stand point of having experienced each, I suppose in many ways when we were expecting my grandfather to die, when we knew it was coming, while it hurts and it's still a process we went through with grieving.....it was almost a peaceful place because we knew he was no longer suffering. With my sister in law who died suddenly of a pulmonary embolism there is always the shock, the instantaneous grief that overtakes you, and I truly believe that the shock of it all made it so much worse for all of us. My grandmother died suddenly....unexpectedly, and even though it has now been several years ago, I am still going through stages of grief with her loss.  when I read all of this, from the perspective of the family or friend, the reactions are perfectly what I'd expect them to me.... maybe I should have qualified my thoughts more specifically ~~ saying for ME, in my adult life, I would be one who wants to know...

delete reply trixyschaos wrote on Sep 27 msowens1 said maybe I should have qualified my thoughts more specifically ~~ saying for ME, in my adult life, I would be one who wants to know...  oh no you didn't have to specify...I was just throwing my thoughts out there.... It's been a beautiful discussion here of a very difficult topic....like others have said, I have truly enjoyed reading the comments and conversing with others. A very refreshing change.

delete reply achraj wrote on Sep 27 i have been thinking since yesterday...really..both sides of the perspective.... am certain about one thing...if it was me, who was suffering...i would want to have the right to tell the doc when to pull the plug...let me go....i would want time with my family and those i love...ensure they are taken care of .....that they will be fine...so i can go in peace...i couldn't go in peace if they weren't okay...... about my loved ones...its a tough question , scenario for me to envision....its the one thing, the only thing that upsets the very balance of me in a manner i cannot put into words...i cannot imagine it...i refuse to imagine it.....i am even scared to put this into words....but i have never had to deal with it....so i have no idea how i will react, do when i have to.... i dont know mo....one day at a time...whatever god throws my way....

delete reply hotstone2go wrote on Sep 28 I have to say from personal experience that the prolonged death is harder on everyone, the patient included. Sudden, unexpected, instant death in my personal opinion, and based strictly on my own experiences is the way to go. No tubes, wires, heroic measures, drugs up the wazoo, people looking at me with pity in their eyes, nope don't want to experience any of that. I've seen it first hand and it is a horrible way to spend your last days and a horrible way to die.

delete reply fatgrandmacat wrote on Sep 28 I would want to know.

delete reply ummancan wrote on Sep 28 I wouldnt want to know.

delete reply semisweetsioux wrote on Sep 29 msowens1 said I love every one of them.....  I feel quite confident in assuming that THEY love YOU, too . . . special people attract special people . . . =o)